the 5th Class CAN be Meelee/Ranged - Page 2

yeah thats how i always try to play, does not always work out that way. was a lot easier to do that when i was younger. now i need my kids to grow up and join me in the fight|||Quote:








WITHOUT weapon switch, mind yall. Here's my ingenious idea that'll tie up the loose ends I see in the 4 announced classes thus far:

When the Monk was announced, I became quite dismayed. And not because he's totally not awesome. But the balance of classes just doesn't seem right.

"Where's the tank?" I ask.

The Barb, most people have been telling me. Yeah-the-****-right. He wants to run in with guns (or hammers or swords) blazin with one in each hand. Don't tell me he's about defense and taking damage. In DII (I'll keep comparisons to a minimum), he was second in defense to the Paladin by a looong shot. With the final character to be revealed almost too obvious to be obviously an archer or ranged physical of some sort, that leaves out any option for a true platemailed tank...

Or so one would think...

My idea of an archer has a wrist mounted crossbow, like so: http://lilith.gods-inc.de/macavity/I...s-huntress.jpg

This leaves his second hand open for an awesome shield in which he can bash opponents with, thusly making him a shield basher/archer extraordinaire, in no particular order. We'll call him the Ranger for now. His fighting style allows for utmost protection when it comes to choice of equipment, so you'll likely be outfitting him/her in full plate mails and heavy helmets. This allows him to be in the front lines with the Monk and the Barb, smashing away with his shield skills, and then start firing away at a moments notice. Man that sounds awesome...

So to translate this class' play style to actual gameplay, he would have both his crossbow and shield available by default. His skill and accessibility with both are balanced and he can use both alternately if he wants. Some skills and/or spells will strengthen his shield, letting him sit behind it sentry style and pick away with impunity. Other shield skills will be more offensive, like the Paladin's bash or charge. As for the crossbow, I see no reason why they wouldn't give him a volley shot. The Witch Doctor is having all kinds of fun volleying Skulls of Flame over the hordes of fallen to hit the shamans. Perhaps the Ranger can choose between a volley shot or a straight shot for some or all his arrow/bolt skills. The volley will have less velocity and therefor be slower and hurt less, but allows for single-target precision in crowds to deliver that awesome explosion arrow (or whatever arrow/bolt skills he has). The straight shot having less control but more speed and damage (not counting spell/skill damage, just physical weapon dmg).

The Ranger's resource system would obviously have something to do with keeping the two vastly different but enormously harmonious gadgets in balance.

And there we have it! A perfectly well-rounded group of five original character classes! What's that you tell me? 4-player limit, you say? ****....




Personally I dont think I tank class will be needed, from all ive seen the characters seem to do well enough, if a fight requires I little Defense I can see the barb with a shield for higher AF but he doesnt need it all the time thus he can go with weapons 99% of the time.

I love the crossbow on the wrist idea though, I do thing a duel wield bower would be a very inserting class.|||Quote:








yeah thats how i always try to play, does not always work out that way. was a lot easier to do that when i was younger. now i need my kids to grow up and join me in the fight




Haha, this should be put in the site header.

@ Diablocalibur: Don't worry 'bout nerfing this and that, in the end it is all about math, what is really necessary in a class-idea is the idea in it (did you get it? ). A groundbreaking idea goes a long way.

I liked your idea, I just find it kinda hard to picture volley shots with crossbows, you can't change the intensity of the pull.|||It is a neat idea, but you have to remember blizzard does not want to have class roles (tanks, healers and DPS ) everyone is there to to preform damage. Although they do seem to be following the archetypes from D2.

Brute Melee barb into barb

Holy warrior paladin into monk

Elemental Caster sorceress into wizard

Dark Warrior necromancer into witchdoctor

Archer amazon into ???? Would be my guess

and if that goes like that i bet the expansion will have something like a Shaman to replace the druid, since there both nature based ( shaman can have some minor shape-shifting ability, i doubt there will be werewolf or bear anymore.)|||Unless I'm mistaking, the only two fire skills so far are the Witch Doctor's Skull Bomb (or whatever its name is) and the Wizard's Hydra. Therefore, I think the fifth class should and will have some fire skills. I'm guessing we'll see some ranged character with exploding arrows/bolts/throwing weapons, and/or some Assassin-like fire traps.

Also, so far, the Witch Doctor has the only skill that does black magic damage. Unless it is changed to arcane damage, it would seem strange that only one skill does this. Maybe the fifth class does some dark, spooky things as well? |||Wiki says there is a Firebats and unseen Pit of Fire.|||Ah, thanks for looking it up, I stand corrected. Though I do think fire is still a bit underrepresented, and the fifth class may still have a dedicated fire and/or black magic 'tree'.|||I'm officially calling my idea/class, the Sentinel. He's a brilliant genius inventor who tries to make a device to travel and/or control time and, after much trial and error, inadvertently ends up with a wrist-mounted crossbow with an extra arm to adjust for volley shots. He also tucked in a hookshot for good measure.

After hearing news of the meteor and feeling that it was time and time which had fallen into place, he dons his full suit of armor from his Paladin days (zakarum shield included) and sets off for New Tristram.

As for the fire skills discussion, I don't think anything looks better accompanying a fiery flame than the beautiful arch of an arrow.|||You should do a topic for your sentinel class, you could try making a few skills and etc. And could flesh out your background.

You could have a look in the Fan Classes - The Full List thread to have an idea.

the 5th Class CAN be Meelee/Ranged

WITHOUT weapon switch, mind yall. Here's my ingenious idea that'll tie up the loose ends I see in the 4 announced classes thus far:

When the Monk was announced, I became quite dismayed. And not because he's totally not awesome. But the balance of classes just doesn't seem right.

"Where's the tank?" I ask.

The Barb, most people have been telling me. Yeah-the-****-right. He wants to run in with guns (or hammers or swords) blazin with one in each hand. Don't tell me he's about defense and taking damage. In DII (I'll keep comparisons to a minimum), he was second in defense to the Paladin by a looong shot. With the final character to be revealed almost too obvious to be obviously an archer or ranged physical of some sort, that leaves out any option for a true platemailed tank...

Or so one would think...

My idea of an archer has a wrist mounted crossbow, like so: http://lilith.gods-inc.de/macavity/I...s-huntress.jpg

This leaves his second hand open for an awesome shield in which he can bash opponents with, thusly making him a shield basher/archer extraordinaire, in no particular order. We'll call him the Ranger for now. His fighting style allows for utmost protection when it comes to choice of equipment, so you'll likely be outfitting him/her in full plate mails and heavy helmets. This allows him to be in the front lines with the Monk and the Barb, smashing away with his shield skills, and then start firing away at a moments notice. Man that sounds awesome...

So to translate this class' play style to actual gameplay, he would have both his crossbow and shield available by default. His skill and accessibility with both are balanced and he can use both alternately if he wants. Some skills and/or spells will strengthen his shield, letting him sit behind it sentry style and pick away with impunity. Other shield skills will be more offensive, like the Paladin's bash or charge. As for the crossbow, I see no reason why they wouldn't give him a volley shot. The Witch Doctor is having all kinds of fun volleying Skulls of Flame over the hordes of fallen to hit the shamans. Perhaps the Ranger can choose between a volley shot or a straight shot for some or all his arrow/bolt skills. The volley will have less velocity and therefor be slower and hurt less, but allows for single-target precision in crowds to deliver that awesome explosion arrow (or whatever arrow/bolt skills he has). The straight shot having less control but more speed and damage (not counting spell/skill damage, just physical weapon dmg).

The Ranger's resource system would obviously have something to do with keeping the two vastly different but enormously harmonious gadgets in balance.

And there we have it! A perfectly well-rounded group of five original character classes! What's that you tell me? 4-player limit, you say? ****....|||i agree with you that i was a bit upset when they announced the monk for pretty much the same reason. i wanted a sword/shield tank and a archer(mainly archer) and the monk killed one of them for sure. your idea sounds interesting but i really like my archer to be more about quickness than strength but that does not mean your idea would not also be fun to me. my only concern would be balance. usually in these type of games the long range character are the easiest to kill. to give the best defense to a ranged character might be really unbalanced.

now to balance it i would assume they would lower the damage of either the crossbow or the shield (probably crossbow) to the point where it might take too long to actually kill anything. with a nerfed crossbow to balance the class you would end up using your shield 80% of the time or killing it transit which would bring us right back to the nimble archer.

i must say however that i like the creativity of the class.|||yes. i kinda like the idea. but i prefer my rangers long range focused. (spears or bow/xbow)

and with no custom stats, you couldn't decided if you wanted to focus on range or shield bashing. (though i think thats what the runes are for, but I havent looked into them much, yet)

I once was thinking of a double-shield class. that could be fun.

but it won't happen as there are no archers announced yet.|||The 5th class will be mainly ranged because that's the class archetype the game is missing the most right now.

The barbarian is the current tank melee archetype, but a shield-focused (paladin-esque) class may be introduced in the expansion.|||really hope one is as it is a fun class for me, usually. hell just give me back the paladin in an xpac...just umm make sure he forgot how to throw hammers|||Thanks for the feedback, Apocalypse. You're right about the OP issue, which strangely I haven't even considered yet.

-perhaps we could nerf his firing rate

-bow skills could have less AoE styles- we want him to be a true sniper anyways, not mage-like a la the DII Amazon.

-Shield skills could possibly demand that he put his crossbow away for full proficiency, and vice versa.

Otherwise, I don't think nerfing bow damage is too necessary, as long as it's not too powerful in the AoE department.|||Or maybe we could downplay shield tactics but then we would have to downplay his entire Defense game, but not by too much. Plate mail instead of full plate is good still in my op.

Also, my nephew had brought up a good idea about the Ranger's travel skill (a la teleport/leap/spirit walk/double jump(?)). It can be a hookshot that is a part of his wrist contraption. Walls don't necessarily have to be the targets, he could simply shoot the ground around him in a small-ish radius and use the momentum to propel him forward.|||Quote:








Or maybe we could downplay shield tactics but then we would have to downplay his entire Defense game, but not by too much. Plate mail instead of full plate is good still in my op.

Also, my nephew had brought up a good idea about the Ranger's travel skill (a la teleport/leap/spirit walk/double jump(?)). It can be a hookshot that is a part of his wrist contraption. Walls don't necessarily have to be the targets, he could simply shoot the ground around him in a small-ish radius and use the momentum to propel him forward.




Oh my god, you've just made the Link class. I won't respect Blizz if they don't put that in the game and have Myamoto at the launch.

+: Only 4 players at multiplayer is sad. =/|||lol i bet even in games of 4 i end up alone most of the time. people who play diablo have always been so greedy they are used to running off alone. even now with shared loot the idea of going off alone will be burned into their minds. that plus they wont wanna share shrines lol|||Multiplayer games are usually better when you play with people you know, that wanna play with you, not just play with people.

The next character will be.... - Page 2

If the final class would be black, I would name him JohnShaft.|||...a ranged type with no magical skills. Just my assumption based on:

Barbar - meele, does not use magic.

WD - meele/ranged, uses magic.

Wizard - ranged, uses magic.

Monk - meele, uses magic.

So we have:

2x meele

1x ranged

1x meele/ranged

3x magic type

1x nonmagic type|||I would personally much prefer each class to be able to effectively wield a bow and make the 5th class something else|||Quote:








I would personally much prefer each class to be able to effectively wield a bow...




What do you mean by "effectively"? To solo hell? More? Because every class has its primary role, there would be no reason to have classes at all. Just one jack-of-all-trades type. Nonetheless, I'm sure there will be a lot of space for odd viable builds with every single class in Diablo 3.|||Quote:








I would personally much prefer each class to be able to effectively wield a bow and make the 5th class something else




to do this all 5 classes would need bow skills which would either make the bow uselss of far too good. i much rather have a dedicated archer

The next character will be....

Black. In skin color, maybe soul, but who knows. Basically thats the only thing that was present in the previous Diablos that is not currently present (AFAIK) IN DIII is a black character. They may go on a limb and do something crazy like add a nonhuman player character, but i think that's unlikely seeing as how they recycled the barbarian and necromancer (witch doctor).

As for class it will be something ranged, a ranger perhaps. hopefully it will be something new and unique, i just hope to god it's not a rogue.|||Quote:








Black. In skin color, maybe soul, but who knows. Basically thats the only thing that was present in the previous Diablos that is not currently present (AFAIK) IN DIII is a black character. They may go on a limb and do something crazy like add a nonhuman player character, but i think that's unlikely seeing as how they recycled the barbarian and necromancer (witch doctor).

As for class it will be something ranged, a ranger perhaps. hopefully it will be something new and unique, i just hope to god it's not a rogue.




Isn't the WD black? Plus he has a Jamaican-like accent, factor in the character archetype it fits in with with an African tribal theme. Although it's fine if there is two characters with black skin. I always found it kind of bigoted for game companies to include one character of a certain race just to remain PC.|||As long as they have a skill tree dedicated to killing with a bow, I could care less what the class name, skill color or accent is.|||Quote:








As long as they have a skill tree dedicated to killing with a bow, I could care less what the class name, skill color or accent is.




agreed 100%|||oh he is black..dammit i thought he was white|||I always though of the WD as central american, but he could fulfill a variety of cultures.|||Quote:








As long as they have a skill tree dedicated to killing with a bow, I could care less what the class name, skill color or accent is.




+1, they are obviously including someone / something that kill stuff with a ranged weapon ( minus the witch doctor blowgun ? thing )|||sanctuary in not earth i could care less about the color of the characters skin unless it looked stupid like pink skin :P

seriously why bother with something that is in reality an difference in the pigment on the skin of various individuals of the same race here on earth.|||Ive got to go with a Ranger/Scout type class that used a bow/crossbow and make use of traps.|||Maybe it will be a dark elf/ranger. That would be bad ***. Like a Drizzt Do-Urden character of the R.A. Salvatore's books. Essentially he's an elf/ranger whose people live underground and have black/purpleish skin. We will see.

Look what i found in gallery ^^ - Page 2

LOL



But look look.... |||If it isn't the Rogue I will be very shocked sad dismayed and pissed i wont get to play a ranged class. cause thats what i always played as a main toon on d2

Look what i found in gallery ^^

The folder Blizzcon 2010 Gameplay Movie with folowing info :

The Rogue makes her debut, plus multiplayer action.

Flux, u must be hiding something from us Well, ofc its just a guess but still isnt it to early for making such folders?|||lol. Maybe they did it to see if anyone would actually notice.|||Or rogue is just the general assumed name for being the 5th class. Since all speculation in this forum points towards rogue, regardless the skincolor. It might very well be Flux's own preference |||Its going to be a super rainbow princess on a glitterpony. We all know this already guys, come on.|||Quote:








Its going to be a super rainbow princess on a glitterpony. We all know this already guys, come on.




I disagree, I think the glitterpony is on top this time.... 0.o|||Quote:








I disagree, I think the glitterpony is on top this time.... 0.o




So who's riding the pony? |||Quote:








So who's riding the pony?




The super rainbow is of course!|||its over 9000 levels of cuteness!!!

sorry i just had to|||But is that 9000 a softcap or a hardcap |||oh no, mythe about to open another can of worms...........lol

The fifth class will be a Middle Eastern ranger. - Page 3

Walker, Texas Ranger.|||I don't actually think he'll be eastern...

A Rogue variant would be awesome!|||Middle eastern ranger sounds pretty good to me - I've always been kinda partial to the Lut Golain mercenary - have him as a siege specialist, that way you can have your sword and shield/heavy armour tree, your archery/ranged tree, and your seige tree with traps and other related skills.



This way you get the archer everyone wants, and the cool looking lots of armour+shield/single handed weapon combo, or polearms, plus trap/miscellaneous extra stuff to fill in any gaps missing from the previous 4. Works for me.|||it will be chuck norris jonolith. do not underestimate chuck|||Duh. It's going to be Legolas.|||http://www.kimasurf.com/blog/wp-cont...07/subotai.jpg

Fifth class is SUBOTAI to aid CONAN the BARB!

The fifth class will be a Middle Eastern ranger. - Page 2

Lone Ranger?|||Night Ranger!

|||Saxton Hale!

Wait, no, wrong game. My mistake.|||The holy ranger, St. Ranger ?

Wirt|||David Hasselhoff?|||Quote:








Saxton Hale!

Wait, no, wrong game. My mistake.




Saxton Hale would just be too overpowered.|||The Monk already has some kind of middle-eastern theme to him... some people would say far-eastern, but in my opinion he looks more arabian than asian.

And since I live in the middle-east, my opinion counts like 2 opinions!|||Ford Ranger perhaps? Fits seemlessly in with the Diablo lore I think

|||people still make chuck norris jokes?

damn|||Sorry guys, it can't be chuck norris due to his overwhelming weakness to monks.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JLO1YIWQuXE

How About Druid's

Please bring Druid's to Diablo 3.|||I'd have to concur, but make them more bad ***.|||It's called Diablo 3 for a reason |||nah no more druids. we need something new and badass. Like a giant snake.|||Quote:








nah no more druids. we need something new and badass. Like a giant snake.




But how does a snake wear pants..? |||Or... a druid who can shapeshift into a giant snake that wears pants!

Alright, something druidical (as in nature based) could be expected though, you know a hybrid with some tree and natural control spells and ranged bow attacks (no pets, please)

But, it would mess thematically with the WD...|||what if it was a chuck norris druid, no but seriously i never really got into druids that much in d2, barb was always my fav!|||Spine shooting Porcupine ftw...

The predators!

I think It will be a Native american looking ranger // melee class with a close bond to nature....That would be a nice class.

Good with trowing knives and axes, bows, trowing spears. Spears, swords, axes, staves, hand weapons....

think of the predators. From the predator movie.|||OOW Aliens vs Predator vs Diablo, I smell a Michael Bay flick...































God I hate his movies.|||they've come for the hunt...and stayed for the loot|||Yeah I know..Alien vs predators is pure crap. But as a class for diablo 3 I don't mean a predator...but some kind of hunter you know....with out it having to look like the wow one.|||Quote:




Good with trowing knives and axes, bows, trowing spears. Spears, swords, axes, staves, hand weapons....




Ill take the throwing knives, axes, spears and bows; leave the staves, hammers and swards to the other classes.

Of course his skill set should include close combat skills that involve his throwing weapons.

Add another "5th class" thread to the list...

Well it's my first time ever trying to "guess" at the fifth class, but I do know how many of these are out there. Ranging from deranged killer clown (Sweet Tooth?) to more serious Rogue/Ranger classes. I fall into the category of more serious guesses. Also, I discovered how bad I am at coming up with "clever" names for skill trees. So here it is!(Quoted for highlight)


Quote:




Diablo 3 5th Class

Scout

Tree 1 - The Bow tree (Some catchy name as it covers both bows and Nature based magics)

**The Scout has spent his/her entire life perfecting the art of killing from afar or not killing at all. A master of both his/her bow and the use of natural magics to enhance his/her chosen weapon.

Tree 2 - Traps (Not unlike the assassin's but following the nature based theme. Also "Traps" is boring... catchy name please)

**The Scout is trained in the use of traps for both evading pursuers, Ambushing key enemies and debilitating would-be combatants.

Tree 3 - The evasion/stealthy tree (Again catchy name needed. Follows the nature theme and gives a possible druid-like element)

**The Scout has also learned a various number of survival skills. Most of which come from the study of various animal life.

Resource - Again... need some catchy name.

** Starts out at a max amount. The maximum amount increase based on character level. The resource is regenerated via killing an enemy or using certain abilities from Tree 1 or Tree 3.



Bascially I think this would make an interesting class. If no one likes the Nature theme change it to a mage-like theme and it should work the same lol.




What do you guys think?|||I think I'd like some more details and specifics about skills, to form a fair opinion. My vision of evasion/stealth might differ a lot from yours. Esp as stealth or scouting type skills don't fit in Diablo, since the game is too fast-paced and the levels aren't very large. (A variety of chars had them in pre-D2 development, but they were removed since they weren't really useful.)|||I probably shouldn't have used the word "Stealthy" as "Trickery" would be more or less the gist of it.

For example of the skills I will just do all three tree's off the top of my head (hadn't really thought specific skills too too much).

Tree 1 - Being the bow/ranged tree it would encompass similar skills to both the amazon bow/crossbow skills. Also to keep it encompassing all weapons, we would have a throw line. Something like this:

Throw Expertise (+flat damage & +minor attack speed)

\/

Throw Mastery (allow the use of 2x throwing weapons with a decressing/lvl dmg penalty & +critical chance)

\/

Throw Frenzy (similar to the Amazon strafe but with 2 weapons)

As for the nature side of it, it would likely encompass Poison, Physical and Lightning damage boosts. (The lightning again to give a druidism feel to it)

Tree 2 - Traps is a fairly straight forward name. As to not copy the Assassin traps it would be more or less 1-3 shots of some advantages condition. Something like a Web trap to slow enemies down or a trap that releases wasps to slowly eat away health.

Tree 3 - The last tree in my mind would be the cunning trickery tree. Blinding the enemies (the D2 Style of stealth), and just basically giving the "Scout" options to avoid damage and enhance his/his parties damage. Now that I think of it take elements of the amazon Passive and Magic, mixed with elements of the Assassin Shadow Disc tree and throw in some elements of the Necromancer Curse tree.|||Sory to say but this is the same pie on a different plate...

I realy would like to see some original takes on a ranger class but i guess you can only have so many types....

Well, i guess we'll find out soon enough|||I think its gonna be something completely different, I find it hard to believe blizzard would save a standard bow class for last.

But as a class itself, it sounds fine, except for the name "Scout" , just not epic enough |||Catapults. No question, confirmed by a mysterious source. (My bored mind) It will be a stronger version of the barbarian to pull it, maybe a GIANT <--New race? :O Slow attack speed, but massive damage. Skills would include all those different catapults from the bloody foothills.

*/end fail post*|||Quote:








I find it hard to believe blizzard would save a standard bow class for last.




This made me stop and think. Would they? I am sure they have heard all of the chatter about how it should be a ranged class. But if they have another trick up their sleeve we will find out soon.

There has to be a ranged class in the game and perhaps it is planned for an expansion.

Imagine the collective sigh of letdown if it isn't though. People will be quite disappointed. It is the biggest chatter all over the internet besides the Cataclysm expansion for WoW.

Yet another 5th class hope: The Enchanter

I truly wanted to try showing my guess/hope before we know the truth...

Alright, maybe the name could be changed... But "Enchanter" for now does work to describe it well...

The idea is to allow a class which can be either a bow/crossbow or a sword/shield class(but not both at the same time due to the lack of weapon switch)

So let's see...

The Enchanter

Thematically, she is mostly European, you know a good ol' shiny armor class. They look pretty much like the Iron Wolves... They specialize in imbuing magic into objects.

These could be the skill groups:

Imbuing: The tree is focused on imbuing items with elemental magic. By the end-game skills they also have some nice sorc-like twists, with some "shape-shifting". The skills by themselves end up working a lot like the Amazon's elemental skills when used with ranged weapons. Possible skills:

� Fire Enchant: Imbues the given weapon with fire for a short time

� Frost Enchant: Imbues the given weapon with frost for a short time.

� Lighting Enchant: Imbues the given weapon with lightning for a short time.

� Blaze: Imbues the char's boots with fire, letting it burn the ground as he/she passes by,

� Shock Armor: Imbues the char's armor with lightning, making it electrify enemies with each attack received.

� Freezing Form: Imbues the character him/herself with frost. This means that the char gains freezing attack and resistance, and aura of cold, but also loses health over time.

� Burning Form: Imbues the character him/herself with Fire. The rest can be guessed now.

An important note is that skill runes could be used for making, say, a fire arrow turn into a exploding arrow. Or a lightning arrow into a chain lightning arrow. The possibilities are interesting.

Combat Training: These are the ones that allow the class to use weapons betterly, also has some tricky techniques here and there.

Possible skills:

� Precise strike: A single hit which can't be missed. It can make critical hits however and always uses the minimun damage possible. Works with both arrows or swords.

� Trick Blow: The Enchanter does two strikes, one of them is a fake one to distract the target and the second one strikes with a critical strike.

� Pummel: The Enchanter pushes the enemy towards letting it fall down for some seconds. When using swords and shields this can cause a a decent ammount of damage. When using ranged weapons it allows the Enchanter to take a safer distance to attack.

I'm a bit thorn on this "tree". It could have a lot of skills that can be used with any weapon (with some different results) or it could be weapon specific. I also don't know what skills could be useful...

But, it would be nice to see a known ability like "Multishot" actually a skill rune stuff. Adding the Multistrike (or whatever is called) skill rune into precise striking could make it shot a lot of arrows at the same time, or make more than one sword swing.

Enchanting: These skills are probably the most interesting ones. The enchanter enchants certain objects or creatures around him, to make combat work betterly. Some of these work like traps for instance and use items as resources, others work as buffs against mobs.

Possible Skills:

� Item Trap: Enchants an item on the ground to make it explode.

� Decoy: Controls an item on the ground to turn it into a decoy, enemies attack the decoy instead of the Enchanter (the item can be picked afterwards if it's not destroyed by the mobs)

� Floating Weapon: Controls a weapon on the ground, turning it into a temporary ally (the item can be picked afterwards if it's not destroyed)

� Thorns: Enchants an area, making it thorny allowing it to damage enemies for a time.

� Un-enchant: Like the old unsummon skill, allows you to recover the enchanted item before the power consumes.

� Repulsion Trap: Enchants an item on the ground to make it repel enemies.

It's truly an strange set of skills, some item-based skills also depend on the item's stats.

--------------

Hmn... I had not worked on a resource yet... But I do consider it should have 2 simultaneous resources...

One that is used only in the Combat Training skills and partially on the Imbue skills...

Another one that is used only in the Enchanting skills and partially on the Imbue skills...

--------------

Possible problems with the idea... Well, it is way too much a "Jack of all trades" class. It has a bit of a warrior, of a rogue and of a sorcerer... This could be good, but could also make it a way too complicated class...

It's also a problem to focus combat skills not to be biased with ranged attacks. If the enchanter could only have ranged specialized skills it could be interesting too...

----------------

So, what do you guys think? Am I mad?|||The fifth class needs to be ranged, i don't see any here :/

If a Monk and a Wizard got together and popped one out, you would have your enchanter.|||Quote:








The fifth class needs to be ranged, i don't see any here :/

If a Monk and a Wizard got together and popped one out, you would have your enchanter.




My enchanter is ranged...|||I feel like he's trying to be. Your "combat" skills don't seem rang specific if they can be used with words. the same goes for the imbuing skills.

Not trying to be negative, just honest.|||I feel like he's trying to be. Your "combat" skills don't seem rang specific if they can be used with words. the same goes for the imbuing skills.

Not trying to be negative, just honest.

Sorry for the dp|||Well, to be fairly honest, that's exactly the point... I tried thinking of a way that such skills wouldn't be utterly useless when using other kinds of weapons, but it is hard to think it over well...

I myself tried to point that out however, also noticing that it's a problem, and would be easier to make him/her more bow biased...

Post your shapeshifter class desires / ideas!

I know there is a big following for classes with a big focus on shape shifting, so I'd love for people to post their ideas and desires for a shape shifter class in D3.

(Your ideas are not required to be accurate to Diablo canon.)

Personally, i'd like to see a shape shifting class with different trees for Defensive, Offensive, and Passive shifts.

Examples:

Defensive= Some kind of Medusa skill, where snakes morph out of your body and strike nearby attackers periodically, similar to a "Thorns Aura", but done a lot more stylish and bad ***.

Offensive= The ability to morph yourself into specific aggressive animals, or, as I'd personally prefer, the ability to morph your arms into things like big arcane tentacles, or huge spiked claws. animalistic, yet retaining your characters actual humanity. Perhaps the effects could increase visually as you level them up?

Passive= Abilities to provide passive bonus'. Now, when I say passive, I mean after casting. eg. Turning your skin to stone, and for the next 2 minutes receiving a passive -10% damage taken.



There are a few ideas of mine to get this rolling. |||my perfect shapeshifter is one who uses a bow then shifts into someone using a crossbow only to quickly change into someone who uses throwing weapons.



seriously though i would like to see a shapeshifter in the xpac but i want more than 2 forms. i would like to see a magic casting form, and 3 melee forms. the 3 melee forms i would like to see would be more defense, pure offense, and a balanced.|||I would like to see a shapeshifter class which actually shapeshifts. Perhaps his resource system could be gained primarily through shapeshifting, etc, rather than spending the whole time in one form.

I reckon 5 forms would be ideal, with each character then focusing on 2 or 3. Different forms should have powerful, specialised advantages and huge weaknesses so that they are suited to very different situations.|||yeah if you are gonna make a shapeshifter class make it actually need to change shapes often otherwise just introduce a wearwolf class instead|||The Skinwalker.

Not sure if anyone remembers that rumor but it actually sounded very plausible. He was basically a dark druid. He had a werewolf transformation, like the d2 druid, but it made much more sense with the darker theme since a werewolf isn't a natural being. There was also several ghostly transformations and abilities. My favorite aspect was that he used the spilled blood from enemies or himself to boost battle prowess.

It was a dark themed character class a little different from the norm.

The name sucks though.|||Before the Monk class was announced I thought the final two characters would be a Ranger/Archer and a full plate �sword and board� character. I took the second and created a character that would fill the defensive, armored tank, role as well as shapeshifting.

Of course now this class could only be introduced in an expansion because like most of you, I see the role of a ranged physical damage character the most important one to fill in the initial release.

My idea for a shapeshifter would be very different from what we are all used to in D2. I wanted to get away from a single form and have a much faster paced combat with the ability to utilize several different situational shapeshifting forms without feeling like you spread yourself too thin and ending up much, much weaker then a specialist. Who ever heard of a wolf/bear Druid? Think of the shapeshifting forms as very long acting skills/buffs instead of the D2 model.

You would not be able to stay in one form and would have to switch between them as well as the armored human form during gameplay. To make this possible I have all the remaining skills you invest in be available in all forms, including your human form since this class requires some time outside of a shapeshift. It is important for the character to always feel powerful. Instead I put individual, intrinsic characteristics on all the forms to alter gameplay instead of having specific skills that can only be used by one form or another. However, maybe there could be room for a few that are specific as long as it is just a few. I just don�t want a player to be too invested in just one form that they don�t feel powerful the whole time instead of just in that one form.|||I designed a much darker fully armored character than the D2 Paladin. I tied into the canonical idea that humans on Sanctuary are the product of the union of Angels and Demons. Like the Nephlem of history, this new class taps into a power within themselves� it just happens to be power that originated from the demonic side instead of the angelic one.


Quote:




A new knightly order was founded and opened its ranks to both the men and women of Sanctuary. Military discipline and training were married to an understanding of the latent powers within man, granted by their demon ancestors.

This character is not a demon. He is a human who has learned to tap the demonic powers inherent in all humankind due to their dual angelic and demonic origins. He uses this darker side of his ancestry to gain strength to fight the incursion of the Burning Hells.

This character is order where the barbarian is chaos. His strikes are precise and calculated. His movements are quick and deliberate. He is a deadly and disciplined fighter. His equipment is not worn down or ragged. It has been meticulously cared for by a military mind. Dark yet polished to a high gloss, we will see the Shadowknight in primarily in black, dark blues, and grays. Full plate, unadorned and efficient, without the outrageous embellishments of the Barbarian, is the Shadowknight's armor of choice. Often equipping a sword and shield, the Shadowknight is also practiced at wielding other one and two hand weapons.|||The Shapeshifting Forms I listed under the �Demonic Visage� tree. (This was well before the skill trees and tiers of skills were taken out by Blizzard)

Demonic Visage:

Scourge � a small, upright scavenger(from D2)-like creature with bony protrusions, large hands, and long arms.

• Offensive form with lightning fast Zeal-like attacks, moving almost instantaneously from one target to the next within the expanded weapon range, returning to his original position at the end of the attack.


• Weapon range increased three times


• Up to 5 attacks with a max of 2 attacks per enemy


• Negative armor and life modifier

Obsidian Golem � humanoid black rock monolith with shifting light patterns under the surface

• Defensive form with high survivability but negative damage modifiers


• All attacks have a 30% chance to stun


• Large +armor and +damage reduction to mitigate physical attacks

Elemental Specter - a smoky, indistinct humanoid form

• High elemental resists


• Damage converted to equal parts fire/cold/lightning

Inferno Knight � a large red humanoid demon with burning skin and folded wings. He holds the characters specific weapons but they are engulfed in flames.

• Highly offensive form that suffers from a large life drain while transformed


• All attacks have a 30% chance to create an AoE explosion on point of impact


• All attacks (magical and physical) receive an increased 20% in damage

Anyway, that was my idea of a shapeshifter I would personally love to play. The full lore and background story as well as a list of possible skills to use while in these forms can be found at this LINK There are also pictures of how I see the different forms looking.

How upset would you be if it's not an Archer type character? - Page 5

ManiaCC its only easy for you cause you have seen done before, on tv, in a movie, in a game, in person when your friend showed you, You already knew something about the bow going into it.

My point is someone that doesn't have any knowlege of even what a bow is would have a harder time shoting it then swinging a sword

Its like saying If I was to hand a caveman a gun and don't tell him how it works. How long do you think it would take him to shoot it. (most likely himself in the face)

Red, I use to do LARP (live action roll playing) and hitting a actively blocking person with a sword (all be it a fake one) its not as hard as hitting a moving target with a bow.|||Quote:








Just curious how big of an impact that would leave... Thoughts?

I personally am not thrilled about losing the Necromancer, but I'm sure the Witch Doctor will turn out to be just as cool. Plus, I kind of feel like I mastered the Necro in the previous game, it's time for something new. As far as the 5th character is concerned, I really don't care if it's an archer or not, though it seems to make the most sense. I too played the hell out of the Amazon to the point where it might actually be nice to have something else.

I'm curious if you guys feel the same way..




Scroll down a bit. I started a thread very similar to this about a week ago.

IMO, I would be pleasantly surprised by something different. But chances are, it's going to be a ranged physical damage dealer.

TOE|||Quote:








I can't possibly see how that could be harder than hitting a moving target (or an armored target with a small break in armor) with a bow. Granted, I have not ever had the occasion to whack someone with a flail, but still.




with flails you have to account for the backswing of the weapon. Without proper handling its very easy to hit yourself or lose control of the swing.

In this way a weapon on a segmented chain is harder to use then a sword. Of course different swords are harder or easier depending on how good you are, your training and what part of the body they use.

For some swords that uses the wrist is the easiest while for others the ones that use your elbow or your shoulder is the easiest.

add to that the fact that fighting with 2 weapons are much harder then fighting with one. Due mainly to the increased attack surface and the added stain of having to account for much more lines of attack then with just one weapon.

Bow and arrows are also very difficult weapons to use here a crosbow is far easier and takes less training to use for the average person. The largest bows are still something not just anybody can draw just like that.

The stain of holding it drawn while you aim also adds to the difficulty.

Myself i just train with bokken and jo regulary(every saturday) so those are the weapons i am most familiar with. But since we have various medieval weeks here and also some reenactments. I have tested flails, warhammers, maces, shortswords, longswords, spears, bo, danish axes and of course short bow and long bows(low draw weight).

Fighting at melee takes far more skills and training then most people think.

Just as throwing a punch and really use the force generated from the ground up through your hips and out through your arm and fist is very different.

How upset would you be if it's not an Archer type character? - Page 4

The amazon in D2 was my least favourite character. Element-based arrows and javelins made her feel a lot like a clone of the sorceress. What set her apart was that she could also fight in melee - something the wizard in D3 can do anyway.

I think they'll have to introduce a ranged class to satisfy the fans, but it needs a new slant to be even vaguely interesting - and an interesting way of dealing with enemies that get close.|||I can not say i would be mad to the point i would want to do something i would regret, i would be disappointed though. Rogue in Diablo, the Amazon in Diablo II was the first character i made and played. There skill are usually copied from the previous game, but i like shooting a bow. Some of the most awesome people shot bow... Robin hood, Legolas, green arrow.

But on a serious note, part of me is saying why would the save the archer class for last, and why was it the first class they worked on. This class has to have something unique and complex because how long they have been working on it. No matter what i will be on her as soon as they announce the class for diablo. YAH! blizzcon tomorrow!



Ps

please be a bard! (crossing fingers)|||Quote:




The difference is any one can pick up a sword and swing it to hit someone.

You can't even fire a arrow out of a bow without some knowledge of the bow.




There is a world of difference between swinging an object and performing an actually practical strike. Most people I've met don't even know the elementary concept of what it means to throw a punch. Suffice to say, if you are smart enough to figure that one out, you are smart enough to figure out a bow. And I would argue the physical and mental stress involved in a melee combat far exceeded anything any archer would ever conceivably have to deal with. Don't underestimate cavemen.


Quote:




And why do you think magic needs to have complex equations?




I am biased. Training to be a scientist. WD might not have to deal with these, but the Wizard probably does.|||I'd actually like to see Diablo's spin on a Bard class.

Back to the topic at hand. I wouldn't be upset if the 5th class wasn't a ranged physical. Confused, but not upset.

The Rogue archetype is the only thing we're missing in the vanilla game.|||Quote:








The difference is any one can pick up a sword and swing it to hit someone.

You can't even fire a arrow out of a bow without some knowledge of the bow.




I beg to differ my friend .. I never ever had a bow in my hand and until few weeks ago.. My friend put a bow into my hands and told me "look, hold it like this, insert arrow this way, pull a string, aim and release" and I was doing just fine.. Shooting directly to target.. Hell.. Even my girlfriend did it pretty well

I am not saying that mastering a archery is easy or easier than mastering any another weapon...but using a bow is not rocket science |||Quote:










I am not saying that mastering a archery is easy or easier than mastering any another weapon...but using a bow is not rocket science




Try it on a moving target. |||Quote:








There is a world of difference between swinging an object and performing an actually practical strike. Most people I've met don't even know the elementary concept of what it means to throw a punch. Suffice to say, if you are smart enough to figure that one out, you are smart enough to figure out a bow. And I would argue the physical and mental stress involved in a melee combat far exceeded anything any archer would ever conceivably have to deal with. Don't underestimate cavemen.






Wait, did you just say if you can throw technically correct punch that you can shoot a bow? That's like saying just cause I know how to throw a punch I should know how to lock on a correct gogoplata (that's a Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu hold for those that don't know)





Being on the front line is less to do about mental prowess and more to do with emotional control, being someone that use to wrestle and now trains in the martial arts, I have first hand experience with this. In fighting you have to control your emotions. A lot of times you almost shut off your brains thinking half and go purely on instinct. This is why well trained soldiers get POST traumatic syndrome, cause it is not until later when they have time to think about what they have done do they get effected. On the other hand a marksmen is always thinking about his shots. This is why it takes a special kind of person to be a sniper in the military. Are there exceptions, sure, but there are in all things.



I don't underestimate cavemen (cause he can always club me when I am sleeping) I just know they aren't going to shoot a bow and kill someone till they have gained some working knowledge of how the bow works. and it takes much less time to figure out how to hit someone with a sword then a bow. I know, I have used both.






Quote:








I am biased. Training to be a scientist. WD might not have to deal with these, but the Wizard probably does.






That's just your beliefs of what a fantasy world would be like and since it is a fantasy we will never know the truth




Quote:








Try it on a moving target.




WORD! Try to hit a lateral moving target heading west at 6MPH at a distance of 50yards with the wind blowing 10MPH to the east and tell me it didn't take some thought to pull that shot off. Its hard and takes a heck of a lot more time to even pull off then swigging a sword and hitting a oncoming attacker.

Also Maniaccc, you only knew how to shoot the bow after someone that had experience showed you what to do, If he was to just hand you a bow and say shoot it how long would you have taken to even do that? I am guessing much longer then if he handed you a stick and said hit that dummy

O by they way woman tend to be better shots then men so the fact that she shot good shouldn't come as a surprise.

Not saying sword fighters are as dumb as a box of rocks, just saying it takes more training and more throught to use a bow then to use a sword.|||Quote:








WORD! Try to hit a lateral moving target heading west at 6MPH at a distance of 50yards with the wind blowing 10MPH to the east and tell me it didn't take some thought to pull that shot off. Its hard and takes a heck of a lot more time to even pull off then swigging a sword and hitting a oncoming attacker.




I've only done it with a rifle. I can't even imagine how hard it would be with a bow and arrow. I tried it when I was in high school and I failed miserably, even though I was a decent shot on a static target.|||Quote:








WORD! Try to hit a lateral moving target heading west at 6MPH at a distance of 50yards with the wind blowing 10MPH to the east and tell me it didn't take some thought to pull that shot off. Its hard and takes a heck of a lot more time to even pull off then swigging a sword and hitting a oncoming attacker.




It's not really harder than hitting someone with sword or flail who is actively blocking your blows..

I will say it again..mastering Archery is hard...very hard.. but shooting with bow is easy.. easy as swinging with sword .. my opinion.|||Quote:








It's not really harder than hitting someone with sword or flail who is actively blocking your blows..




I can't possibly see how that could be harder than hitting a moving target (or an armored target with a small break in armor) with a bow. Granted, I have not ever had the occasion to whack someone with a flail, but still.

How upset would you be if it's not an Archer type character? - Page 3

I wouldnt care. I was actually hoping for a dragonkin or a mech or hungrybear, the double rainbow guy. Then I can golfclap Blizz once again.|||INCONSOLABLE!

|||I'd commit suicide.|||Quote:








Just cause the character is not an archer does not mean it will be a new concept, more likely it will be something we have seen before.




This is why I said "it could be a new concept". I have hopes for it, but I know its not a 100% probability.


Quote:








For many games, ranged "archer" classes tend to have very few utilities: traps, pinning shots (usually even called "Pinning Shot" :P), dodge passives, etc. It just isn't as interesting to me as something like Mirror Image or Slow Time. Nor as effective as teleport or whatever.




I also believe that having both attack and move linked to the same input also causes ranged to not be as effective as say a caster or melee.|||Quote:








For many games, ranged "archer" classes tend to have very few utilities: traps, pinning shots (usually even called "Pinning Shot" :P), dodge passives, etc. It just isn't as interesting to me as something like Mirror Image or Slow Time. Nor as effective as teleport or whatever.

That isn't to say the archer class doesn't have potential, though. Time will tell.




i agree that the archer class has not been done as good as it can be. most games tend to just slap different forms of damaging arrows instead of giving the archer more utility. i would be happy with more crowd control skills and pets (i really want pets!) but like you said, time will tell. the one thing ARPG's lack with archers is the feel of the bow, if that makes sense. example is oblivion, bows were so fun to use since you had to aim and distance/elevation played big into that but in D3 style games you cant really add that so they need to make up for it with the skills. well lets hope i get my archer and they do it better than anyone has before|||Quote:




I also believe that having both attack and move linked to the same input also causes ranged to not be as effective as say a caster or melee.




Don't most ARPGs do the shiftclick thing anyway?|||Would like to see some rouge class, but if it would be diffrent I'm not so dissapointed. Since part 1 I prefer to play mage|||Quote:








the one thing ARPG's lack with archers is the feel of the bow, if that makes sense. example is oblivion, bows were so fun to use since you had to aim and distance/elevation played big into that




I think that's the big thing, bows are percussion weapons. You need to have skill to use one effectively, something that a point and click game like Diablo will never capture. Unless they add all kinds of complexities to the class, like aiming for body parts. Something I don't know if it would work in a diablo game.




Quote:








Don't most ARPGs do the shiftclick thing anyway?




I don't know what I would do without shiftclick in a ARPG, probably stop playing LOL|||Well, if you want to get to the nitty gritty of it, all weapons require tremendous amount of skill to use effectively. Melee is kinda left out just as much as archery in this respect. ARPGs are generally an abstraction of combat, anyway, no need for implementing specific skill things ala parries or arcing shots.

But if that was ever implemented, I want to do complex math equations to solve for every spellcast for fairness sake. Let spellcasters show the physical class biatches where the real skill is.|||Quote:








Well, if you want to get to the nitty gritty of it, all weapons require tremendous amount of skill to use effectively. Melee is kinda left out just as much as archery in this respect. ARPGs are generally an abstraction of combat, anyway, no need for implementing specific skill things ala parries or arcing shots.

But if that was ever implemented, I want to do complex math equations to solve for every spellcast for fairness sake. Let spellcasters show the physical class biatches where the real skill is.




The difference is any one can pick up a sword and swing it to hit someone.

You can't even fire a arrow out of a bow without some knowledge of the bow.

Hand a cave man a sword and he will still be able to kill with it, hand him a bow and he will likely use it for fire wood. lol



And why do you think magic needs to have complex equations? A lot of magic comes natural, if it didn't the barb wouldn't have skills like Hammer of Ancients, and Seismic Slam.

Don't forget about the WD skills. You think he knows advanced algebra? He doesn't even know dental hygiene

How upset would you be if it's not an Archer type character? - Page 2

I have the wizard. I'm not too concerned about what the last class is.|||I'm hoping that it's not an Archer, Big Tuna.|||Quote:








I have the wizard. I'm not too concerned about what the last class is.




imagine a rpg without a wizard (mage,sorc whatever they call it) and thats how a lot of people will feel about the lack of a archer|||Quote:








imagine a rpg without a wizard (mage,sorc whatever they call it) and thats how a lot of people will feel about the lack of a archer




Wouldn't matter. They'd have someone capable of ranged gameplay, whether it is a wizard or an archer.|||i guess i like having both.|||Quote:








i guess i like having both.




Nothing wrong with that. Just tends to not be my cup of tea.

The problem I have with pure ranged classes in a game like Diablo is that it is really frustrating when you can't stay at range. It makes the whole experience kind of pointless to me.

Especially a ranged character limited to seven skills. |||Quote:








Nothing wrong with that. Just tends to not be my cup of tea.

The problem I have with pure ranged classes in a game like Diablo is that it is really frustrating when you can't stay at range. It makes the whole experience kind of pointless to me.

Especially a ranged character limited to seven skills.




The wizard is a ranged class|||Quote:








The wizard is a ranged class




Yup, but mage characters tend to have more utility to them, because they also tend to be more fragile. (That, and they normally aren't purely ranged)

For many games, ranged "archer" classes tend to have very few utilities: traps, pinning shots (usually even called "Pinning Shot" :P), dodge passives, etc. It just isn't as interesting to me as something like Mirror Image or Slow Time. Nor as effective as teleport or whatever.

That isn't to say the archer class doesn't have potential, though. Time will tell.|||I won't be disappointed, I'm a witch doctor kind of guy. |||The pic didn't give it away Thomas... lol

I wouldn't lose any sleep over the lack of an archer class.

In fact I feel the same as Risingred, they tend to be frustrating in a game like diablo cause its nigh imposable to stay at range, that and there skills tend to be boring, here is a fire arrow, here is a ice arrow, here is a...

How upset would you be if it's not an Archer type character?

Just curious how big of an impact that would leave... Thoughts?

I personally am not thrilled about losing the Necromancer, but I'm sure the Witch Doctor will turn out to be just as cool. Plus, I kind of feel like I mastered the Necro in the previous game, it's time for something new. As far as the 5th character is concerned, I really don't care if it's an archer or not, though it seems to make the most sense. I too played the hell out of the Amazon to the point where it might actually be nice to have something else.

I'm curious if you guys feel the same way..|||You made an account just for this. ok...

D2 =/= D3

The playing style of every class will be different, and definitely nothing like D2. I don't really care if there's no range class, although chances are unlikely.

I just want new info, new videos, new everything, and that's all it matters. Sick of watching the same thing for the past 1 year |||You mastered the necro? I'ld like to see some proof of that (I personally think I mastered every class )

As for not having an archer type character....I would be rather pissed and wouldnt feel right. In D2 I tried just about everything and had a lot of fun with several amazon builds and I enjoyed killing everything with a rain of arrows so I'm really hoping that'll be back |||Not including a Ranger/Archer would be like building a house without a toilet.|||Quote:








You made an account just for this. ok...

D2 =/= D3

The playing style of every class will be different, and definitely nothing like D2. I don't really care if there's no range class, although chances are unlikely.

I just want new info, new videos, new everything, and that's all it matters. Sick of watching the same thing for the past 1 year




No, I did not make an account JUST for that question... I made it so I can converse about Diablo 3, obviously...|||Quote:








Not including a Ranger/Archer would be like building a house without a toilet.




Yeah we need an archer class to dispose of our human waste.|||thought we had a thread just like this notlong ago? anyway i would hate it. archers are a staple in RPG games for good reason to not have one would seriously suck|||

I will be this mad.|||I would like it if it wasn't, means the 5th class could be an entirely new concept. It also means the devs are trying to break away from tradition and the stereotypical setup, which I think needs to happen if they wish to continue being generally the best ARPG out there.|||Quote:








I would like it if it wasn't, means the 5th class could be an entirely new concept.




Just cause the character is not an archer does not mean it will be a new concept, more likely it will be something we have seen before. I would also wager that you would upset more people with the lack of an archer character than you would make happy by not having one. Bliz uses 5 characters that allows them to have their melee, ranged, and mage plus 2 left over to do whatever they want with. If they want to experiment and try a new concept those are the 2 they should have tried it with, in other words the WD and monk

How about Ninja/Nightblade as 5th class ?

Everyone assumes that a Rogue/ Ranger/Archer is the 5th class, but thinking a little outside that box, the Ninja/Nightblade Archetype is just as valid and perhaps a bit more "exotic" to fit the flavor of DIII.

The obvious reason that this could "fill" the role of a ranged and melee class with some magic abilities. In terms of past Diablo classes, it might most closely resemble the Assassin. Likely it will be named something other than "Ninja" and have a lore/background consistent with the exotic DIII world. The reason I have for this speculation is that a Stealth based fighter/ranged attacker with some magic-like abilities would allow for considerable flexability in terms of class build. Obviously Bows, throwing stars, and throwing knives would be a primary class skill set. Swords, Polearms, and other exotic weapons would be the melee choices for this class, but it would focus on quick stealth based melee kills, as the class would be weaker than the Barbarian or Monk when facing hordes of enemies directly.

Other skills might involve camoflage and/or invisiblity magic like abilities. Skills designed to kill or incapacitate a single enemy quickly when a stealth melee attack is performed.

Finally, escape and evasion skills such as a flashbomb/tumble behind enemy skill, and leaping/dodging skills to avoid enemy attacks and missile fire.

This Class would be one of the fastest moving classes, as it would use speed instead of armor or spells to soak damage.

Anyway, that's my 2 cents. |||Stealth classes will never work in a Diablo game, for a few reasons.

First off they would suck in a group. As your trying to slow down and stealth to each target your 3 friends just want to rip through everything as fast as they can.

The second reason stealth doesn't work is it not conducive to the kind of combat that is in Diablo, stealth works great for one on one or maybe even one vs two, but when you talk about combat in diablo your talking about fighting hordes at a time.

Also, no matter what anyone says stealth can and would be used to skip content.

The Wiz already fits the Asian theme so they wouldn't make another character with the same theme.

The Monk already has fast combat and light armor, and has spells to soak/deflect damage.

I can tell you spent some time on posting this and its your first post so I kind of feel bad bashing it but it just wont work sorry.|||that sounds pretty interesting, but we will know for sure soon!|||what theeliminator said.

it simply does not fit|||I had a dream that the fifth class were Wardens, from the Warcraft 'verse.

Which kind of fit with what you're talking about.

I could imagine the whining though |||Quote:








I had a dream that the fifth class were Wardens, from the Warcraft 'verse.

Which kind of fit with what you're talking about.

I could imagine the whining though




Hah. I said Warden and it turns out to be a Demon Hunter, which are pretty much the enemies of the Wardens in WoW.

Commence whining about it being named after a class from the Warcraft 'verse?

Screencaps from the trailer

http://diablo.incgamers.com/gallery/...&ppuser=322757

The portion near the end of the trailer where they shifted through different gameplay scenes. Took a screenshot from almost every scene.

Changes coming - Page 2

Yep, some fans actually managed to hit the apple... The Demon Hunter was unexpected, as we all supposed that:

a) The dark mood was supposedly taken by the WD

b) The anti-demon fanatism was supposedly taken by the Monk

But, as unexpected as it is, I find it to my liking...

Changes coming

It just amuses me, looking at this forum the past few days. A few "my wacky idea about the 5th char" threads, a few "how archery might work in d3" threads, and not much else.

How things will change Friday morning, when there's actual 5th char info, screens, gameplay movie, etc... can has excite?|||Excite?



Yes. Very much. I wonder, though, how much of this will be the lamentations of "whah, my particular vision of the archer wasn't implemented!!!!!!" At least for me, my QQ will be epic if we get a goddamned pet centric archer or an Amazon remake. Unless there will be a skillrune to turn the pet into a suicide bomber.

Then I will be happy and explode the bugger out of principle on every opportunity.|||Most likely it will be full of whines and personal opinions that really won't matter.

But I think it will be an awesome class.|||Just think how much fun B is having.. him knowing already what the 5'th class is!|||Quote:








At least for me, my QQ will be epic if we get a goddamned pet centric archer or an Amazon remake. Unless there will be a skillrune to turn the pet into a suicide bomber.

Then I will be happy and explode the bugger out of principle on every opportunity.




LOL

Wins thread in post number 2!|||Quote:








At least for me, my QQ will be epic if we get a goddamned pet centric archer






this would be the greatest news for me, give me a archer with some pets. like i have been saying on the PoE boards, no need for the pets to be common also (wolves and bears) they can make them unique something rpg games dont usually use as pet animals.|||the way to common pet centric archer bores me to death so i agree with you konfeta i would suicide the hell out of the pet at any opportunity just out of principle.|||Whatever the 5th is, it will generate a lot of love and whine... For the first months most will be opinion threads (what do you think of the 5th?) or (I hate the 5th!) or (I love the 5th!)

After that we'll actually start caring for some info... Hopefully, the Diablo drought won't be so bad...

It is quite sad... 5th class threads were some of my favorite ones...|||Quote:








Whatever the 5th is, it will generate a lot of love and whine... For the first months most will be opinion threads (what do you think of the 5th?) or (I hate the 5th!) or (I love the 5th!)

After that we'll actually start caring for some info... Hopefully, the Diablo drought won't be so bad...

It is quite sad... 5th class threads were some of my favorite ones...




LOL. Already pining for the past. You're right though that there will be a lot of hate and love in the coming days. It will be fun to read.|||After reading about the 5th class, it instantly reminded me of one particular speculation thread for some reason. Took an hour to find it, but I think JSLAW nailed it. Even though he actually guesses wrong at the end, his secondary ideas were spot on! Now I can fall asleep without that naggy "oh god this sounds horribly familiar" feeling in my head...

http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/s...d.php?t=777064

Welcome to the shooting gallery - Page 3

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But Lone_Wolf a lot of the skills you suggested can be achieved through different Skill Runes.

That's why the class probably wont be made up of purely Bow skills. If it was I think it would only be played by people that really wanted to play a Bowazon/ OG Rogue, not to many others would even try the class.

As it stands now I still don't know what class I will play first, cause each one has something that interests me.

So if the 5th class has bow skills/ trap skills/ and nature spells, then I would be interested, but if its just Bow skills...

PS: What about a bear that shoots a bow that shoots bears. Now we are talking




Of course it wont only be bow skills that would get boring fast im just pointing out that creating bow skills for a character class to use is in no way hard work.

as for skill runes well that could be said of every character class so its kind of a given.

Still it will be interesting to see how the fifth character class will look and behave.|||I really hate to admit this at the risk of being flamed, but I hope they do a somewhat direct rip-off of the hunter class from WoW. Some really great potential there with a persistent and useful pet (which we haven’t really seen in the game yet), the ability to use ranged weapons only, but with the tools to create distance and kite (frost traps, disengage, etc.) they could do plenty to make the gameplay for this archetype dynamic, and go well beyond simply ‘fire an ice arrow.’ They can tie abilities together, much like they did in WoW, and have a symbiotic relationship between the pet and the ability to deal ranged damage. They can share debuffs, stuns, enhance eachothers damage, etc. create opportunities for escape, etc.



Regardless of whatever class they end up with, I hope it’s a blockbuster, and not just a dull ranged class archetype.|||The WoW hunter is about the dullest ranged class archetype in existence. It's only barely saved by traps.|||Quote:








The WoW hunter is about the dullest ranged class archetype in existence. It's only barely saved by traps.




I obviously disagree.

I think the gameplay is fun, and the skill cap (at least in WoW) was tremendously high. You could pick up a hunter and be decent quite easily (which is dull, admittedly), but they have so many tools to control most any situation if you are good. Regardless, I'm not trying to compare WoW to Diablo 3 or anything like that, I'm just simply hoping that if the 5th class is indeed a physical ranged class, I hope it's got some depth to it, like the hunter.|||Quote:








Regardless, I'm not trying to compare WoW to Diablo 3 or anything like that, I'm just simply hoping that if the 5th class is indeed a physical ranged class, I hope it's got some depth to it, like the hunter.




I hope so too. Personally, I'm fine with the D3 devs taking good ideas from WoW (or anywhere else) if they're appropriate: they've stated clearly that Diablo is not WoW, and I don't think they'll try to impose WoW models on D3 just for the sake of it. Anyway, we'll find out soon enough...|||Depth is nice, but a pet should really stay out of it. It promotes turret gameplay if it has any power (it obviously didn't in WoW, but there are very specific balance reasons for that). If pets were basically distractions, or weak things that encouraged active movement/combat, that would be awesome, but WD pretty much monopolized that exact style of pets already.|||@lone_wolf


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heck we could have arrows that spawn webs or tendrils when they impact something slowing or immobilizing enemies.




Sacred had a skill that spawned spiders(Maybe you got it from there?)they were actual spiders that would attack just like a summon except they died after a bit.Another game Ive played you fire arrows into the air a bit like Assassin Fireblast except several at a time that move forward(or is it backwards) so you have to time them with enemy movements,very different IMO.Bow skills can be as diverse as any other skill the only difference really is its ranged and not close up and often uses a weapons damage as a base.|||I just really hope that the 5th character is highly focused on bows and not other throwing weapons like knives and throwing axes. Throwing spears are a good second option but that would be too close to the D2 Amazon.

Just can't wait to see what Bliz has up thier sleves. |||Quote:








@lone_wolf



Sacred had a skill that spawned spiders(Maybe you got it from there?)they were actual spiders that would attack just like a summon except they died after a bit.Another game Ive played you fire arrows into the air a bit like Assassin Fireblast except several at a time that move forward(or is it backwards) so you have to time them with enemy movements,very different IMO.Bow skills can be as diverse as any other skill the only difference really is its ranged and not close up and often uses a weapons damage as a base.




nope taken from an debate about arcane archer skills that would be fun to have.|||And thus, it was revealed... I like the idea of a Demon Hunter...

Welcome to the shooting gallery - Page 2

I doubt they'll have more than 10 or 12 arrow skills. More than that and they get redundant in function or use. I'd be bored with a bunch of arrow attacks that differ chiefly by the type of elemental damage dealt. That's what runestones are for, ala Hydra.

Also, Bliz is somewhat limited in the effects if they want to avoid overlapping with Wizard functions. I think they want the chars to be distinct, so we're probably not going to see big Blizzard type AoE arrow effects, or things that mimic Slow Time, etc.

They also want to allow a lot of variety in character builds, so just having 25 different arrow attacks seems like a non-starter.

Here's the essential question: What distinguishes an arrow from a melee attack, or from a spell? Arrows do physical damage, like melee attacks, but they're less damaging and have greater accuracy requirements. They hit from a distance like spells, but they deliver primarily physical damage and the projectiles move faster.|||Quote:










You see many like the idea of an ranged character and so they will come up with idea on how such a character could work.

Imagination is a strong force.




But the problem is that all of the skills you made up were essentially the same thing.

It's the same story with a ranged character in any game. Same skills over and over.

And, yes, same with melee characters and spellcasters but in those two cases there is much more variety than:

Fires an ice arrow.

Fires a fire arrow.

Fires an arrow made up of a bunch of arrows.

Fires a poisonous arrow.

Pretty big difference from:

Hits one target really hard.

Hits multiple targets for average damage.

Jumps across the screen and lands, doing damage to target(s).

Slams the ground with weapon, sending a damaging shockwave in all directions.|||Quote:








Because she has to be a rogue/ranger/archer... right?




She (and he) better d*mn well be one, is all I can say.


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What complimentary skills: traps, debuffs, speed, pets, stealth, etc?




I think this is maybe the main question: how will a ranged attacker maintain her range? I'm not making predictions, but I'd like to see an archer that plays a lot more like the D1 rogue than the D2 bowazon, depending on pure ranged offensive power (without doing the same damage as a caster) and tactics, rather than pets or a massively durable tank.

Traps, stealth, debuffs etc might well play a role, but they all strike me as a bit slow for a primary play-style in a game like D3.

Or maybe, to use one of the words near the top of my least favorite and most abused list, Bliz will come up with a new paradigm for a ranged class.|||Better be a shapeshifting character.

A bear that can shoot bows. Make it happen.|||Quote:








But the problem is that all of the skills you made up were essentially the same thing.

It's the same story with a ranged character in any game. Same skills over and over.

And, yes, same with melee characters and spellcasters but in those two cases there is much more variety than:

Fires an ice arrow.

Fires a fire arrow.

Fires an arrow made up of a bunch of arrows.

Fires a poisonous arrow.

Pretty big difference from:

Hits one target really hard.

Hits multiple targets for average damage.

Jumps across the screen and lands, doing damage to target(s).

Slams the ground with weapon, sending a damaging shockwave in all directions.






nope you just focus on the simples bow skills around.

hit one taget with a ranged attack is exactly the same.

doing an aoe rain of arrows is the same as your second one

jumping over your enemy and shot them in the back(s) work like your third

for your forth i already posted an example of a nova type attack.

besides all you posted are this:

1 Single target high damage skill

1 medium damage aoe skill

1 mobility+damage skill

1 ranged bust nova type skill

i can make that with easy with an ranged attacker.

@flux take a look at archers in dnd and you see that you can have plenty of attacks that are ranged without ever using elemental damage at all. But then you also have the arcane archer and then we have plenty of fun new ideas to use.

you can slow, stun, deal damage over time, immobilize, debuff, knockback, blind with just physical damage without effort. Seems i just made 7 skills that are all distinct

i was not joking about thinking about and planning what ranged attacks could be found on a ranger class.

heck we could have arrows that spawn webs or tendrils when they impact something slowing or immobilizing enemies.

we could have an skill that pierce through enemies doing and AOE line attack

we could have arrows that work much like strafe in diablo 2 but they would all home in on one target

we could have a skill that deals more critical damage as it hits vital organs etc

we can have a skill that makes us jump back a distance and letting an arrow fly into an enemy, like a sort of dodge then shot skill.

we could have a skill that knocks the target prone and prevent it from moving or doing any attacks for a set duration.

so i made 13 skills already none of them elemental. Coming up with various ranged skills are not harder then for melee combat or magic.|||Quote:




lso, Bliz is somewhat limited in the effects if they want to avoid overlapping with Wizard functions. I think they want the chars to be distinct, so we're probably not going to see big Blizzard type AoE arrow effects, or things that mimic Slow Time, etc.

They also want to allow a lot of variety in character builds, so just having 25 different arrow attacks seems like a non-starter.




And since the WD already is the ranged attacker with pet tanks/distractions (hopefully excluding the insipid insistence on an archer with a pet so many RPGs have as of late), and since weapon switch is gones (cutting out annoying melee/ranged hybrids) the only logical solution is an archer with traps! Or an archer with some support magic or support alchemy or godknowswhat!

I'll never let that go.|||Quote:








Better be a shapeshifting character.

A bear that can shoot bows. Make it happen.




How about a bow that shoots bears? ...Too WoW?|||Quote:








And since the WD already is the ranged attacker with pet tanks/distractions (hopefully excluding the insipid insistence on an archer with a pet so many RPGs have as of late), and since weapon switch is gones (cutting out annoying melee/ranged hybrids) the only logical solution is an archer with traps! Or an archer with some support magic or support alchemy or godknowswhat!




It's actually fairly unclear what sort of pets the WD will have. Only teh mongrels were enabled in 2008 and 2009, with all the fetish chargers and other stuff disabled. The char design seems to be geared towards short-range spells and short-duration/expendable pets. He's not a necro with really tough pets; mongrels couldn't kill anything on their own last year's demo, and they weren't very tough either.

His other pets may be more hardy, or they may all be basically suicide minions; in fact I sort of expect that, since Bliz clearly wants the WD to be a very constant-action, constant spell casting char. The WD is not a Necro with uber tanks and IM curses and "go get a snack while the monsters beat themselves to death."

I"m actually quite curious to see the WD's skills this year, and try out some of the higher level ones; we've really only had access to a decent variety his attack spells, the past 2 years.

How does that reflect on the Rogue issue? Just that the niche for durable, strong tanks is not yet taken. (And may never be, with the more action-packed style of D3.) I don't expect it for the Rogue, anyway. I could easily see her with Decoy-like summons. Just distractions, short term things you have to recast a lot and use wisely, rather than a Valk-like tank.|||But Lone_Wolf a lot of the skills you suggested can be achieved through different Skill Runes.

That's why the class probably wont be made up of purely Bow skills. If it was I think it would only be played by people that really wanted to play a Bowazon/ OG Rogue, not to many others would even try the class.

As it stands now I still don't know what class I will play first, cause each one has something that interests me.

So if the 5th class has bow skills/ trap skills/ and nature spells, then I would be interested, but if its just Bow skills...

PS: What about a bear that shoots a bow that shoots bears. Now we are talking|||Quote:








I think it will be something like a "Ranger" that not only specializes in bows, but swords, stealth...






i have been saying i would love a ranger class. a class that could go with either a bow or sword and would have some form of pet, a wolf or something. rangers could also have some minor magic skills, buffs or something to that effect. by no means original but what is nowadays?

Welcome to the shooting gallery

With Blizzcon coming up and the long-awaited fifth character reveal, we thought it was a good time for a forum for him/her/it. Because she has to be a rogue/ranger/archer... right?

The bullet point list below is lazily copied from the excellent wiki article. It's got links and citations and lots more quotes, etc.

http://www.diablowiki.net/Fifth_character


Quote:




* The fifth class will be announced at BlizzCon 2010.[3]

* The fifth class was one of the first the D3 Team sketched out. (Likely meaning its a traditional RPG class.)

* There's no character in the game yet who specializes in bows or ranged weapons.

** The fifth character will fit a niche not occupied by any other character. [4]

** The fifth class is said to be very similar to/inspired by a class from an earlier game in the series. [5]

*** The return of any other Diablo 2 chars has been ruled out. (For D3; some might return in expansion packs.)

** The Diablo 1 Warrior is too generic and his combat role is filled by the Barbarian and Monk.

** The Diablo 1 Sorcerer would be redundant with the Wizard.

** The Monk, added in Hellfire is already in the game, though the D3 Monk traces no official lineage to the Hellfire version. (The D3 Team has disowned him and de-canon'ed Hellfire entirely.)

* This leaves the Diablo 1 Rogue as the only realistic returning character option.




If anyone wants to disagree, or argue against it, go for it.

I think it's kind of boring with the 5th char seeming to be so cut and dried in advance. I wish they'd revealed the Rogue last year, so this year we'd all be wildly speculating. It would be clear that some kind of melee char, lighter of a tank than the Barb, was the 5th. But that leaves open a lot of possibilities, and I'm sure no one would have guessed exactly the Monk.

So if you want to guess for teh 5th char, the degree of difficulty should be higher. How will bows work in D3? Will arrows be an item type with varying quality levels? What sort of resource would work best? What complimentary skills: traps, debuffs, speed, pets, stealth, etc?|||Lest you think your interest in a non-character is abnormal... it's not.

The fifth character page in the wiki has around 166k views. This is considerably more than any of the actual character pages; the most of the others are the Barb and Wiz around 85k views.

Admittedly, the other 4 all have skills pages and resource pages and such, with hundreds of thousands of views on them, but just for one page about a non-feature, the 5th char page does amazingly well. Mostly from google hits, I suppose.

It's actually the 3rd most viewed page on the entire Diablo 3 wiki, less than 1% behind Diablo III release date, and since the main page is miles out in first, and it loads by default from the domain name, it shouldn't really count.|||hum lots of contradictions in those quotes.

this: ** The fifth character will fit a niche not occupied by any other character. [4]

contradict this: * There's no character in the game who specializes in bows or ranged weapons

the other classes already take up the niche of heavy armored melee dps as well as light armored fast melee dps and we also have fast light armored ranged magic as well as slower ranged magic/summoner.

that leaves ranged physical but since the fifth class wont specialize in ranged combat nor bows there is no niche left.

thrown weapons as well as crossbows (and guns though i hope they never find their way into a diablo game) are all weapons for a dedicated ranged combatant. So they could not be used as the primary weapons.

But we already has melee and magic covered so it seems it has no niche left to fill.

this seems to point to a hybrid character but how that is going to work is anyones guess because weapon swap is out it wont work well. The only way it could work logically is by using throw weapons.

But thrown weapons are very very rarely used in melee combat since they are not built for it nor does it fill any niche the other character classes does not already fill.

besides if the focus is not on ranged what else could they focus on?

traps? but physical this time...

melee even if it would be stealth focused would still not be its own niche in my opinion its just another melee combatant and then we would lack a ranged physical attacker so that seems like a bad idea.

i dont get how the fifth character is going to fit its own niche without ranged attacks.|||i agree that the archer should ahve already been announced so the 5th would be a mystery. they could have left either the WD or monk til the end and no one would really guess those would have been fun. i hope the main xpac char is a sword/board user though since the monk seems to have killed that for now|||Quote:








i agree that the archer should ahve already been announced so the 5th would be a mystery. they could have left either the WD or monk til the end and no one would really guess those would have been fun. i hope the main xpac char is a sword/board user though since the monk seems to have killed that for now




leaving the WD until last would only have worked if they'd made clear, about 50x, that the necro wasn't returning. Otherwise there would have been gnashing of teeth and rending of garments when the necro-esque WD appeared.

But it certainly would have been a surprise!

I hope something about the rogue is a surprise; how she uses bows or how her resource works or how her support skills are designed. It'll be interesting to see, and I'm sure fans will be instantly very technically-critical. No one did much of that about the Monk, since we had no idea what his playing style was. Everyone knows how bowazons play, and if it doesn't seem like the Rogue is an improvement or is well-balanced, etc, there will be much anger and dismay.|||I can't imagine how much they can do with pewpew skills.

You shoot an arrow. It's made of fire. You shoot an arrow. It's a bunch of arrows. Kind of covers the bases.

I would imagine it wouldn't be a purely ranged class.|||you shot an arrow it shatters into splinters that does AOE physical damage.

you shot an arrow that goes so fast it creates shockwaves(magic) it deals more damage to armored targets as well as stun at a certain % chance.

You shot an arrow it disappear after you shot it and suddenly it hits the monster from its own shadow and cause it to go blind for a while.

you shot an arrow with enough force to throw your enemy back and make it fall down on the ground.

you shot an arrow that target your enemies legs slowing them when it hits.

you start to rotate on the spot your standing letting arrow after arrow fly from your bow doing an AOE nova attacks centered on you. It also push monsters back.

i could go on with much more variants but no risingred there are plenty of things to do with "pewpew" skills|||Quote:










i could go on with much more variants but no risingred there are plenty of things to do with "pewpew" skills




"You shoot an arrow, it does something."|||Yea, It would be kind of boring if the 5th class is just an updated Rogue. I'd be disappointed.



I have a few guesses on what the class will be.

I think it will be something like a "Ranger" that not only specializes in bows, but swords, stealth...

I think it will be an updated Rogue.

I think it will be something based off of the Amazon. Like a "Spartan" or something. Some class that uses shields, short bows, javelins, spears, short-swords...

I think it will be something based off of our Desert Merc from Diablo 2.



Those are my 4 guesses. My 1st guess would be kind of, meh. I hope it's not my 2nd guess. I'd be happly if the 5th class was something like my 3rd or 4rth guess.



What would be totally shocking if it was something completely different. Like a Knight, I know it's unlikely, but thats why it would so shocking. Personally, I like those types of classes. The Warrior and Pally were cool, but I'm not expecting something like them until an expansion. Wait, what if it's the Necro and Blizzard has been lying to us the entire time!|||Quote:








"You shoot an arrow, it does something."




you swing a weapon it does something (barb and monk)

or

you cast a spell it does something (wizard and witch doctor)

guess what risingred the same could be said about the other classes

just because you might not have any ideas for ranged skills does not mean the rest of us have that problem.

I could easily post more then 25 skills just from dnd 4 edition and that is one single game where pewpew skills have been made and used. There are much more games out there that has had ranged skills and its not likely to stop in the future either.

You see many like the idea of an ranged character and so they will come up with idea on how such a character could work.

Imagination is a strong force.